dramaturgy (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
dramaturgy) wrote2003-06-30 01:16 pm
dramaturgy) wrote2003-06-30 01:16 pm
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Okay, does someone want to explain the entire 'removed' deal to me?
Sirius says Molly is a cousin by marriage which seems to me would either mean that she is a sibling of someone who married one of his cousins, a cousin of his spouse or a cousin of his brother's spouse. Since Sirius never mentions being married and there is no spouse noted for Regelus when Harry is looking at the family tree (and since Regelus was younger than Sirius and Sirius was in his lower twenties if not barely twenty when he was sent to Azkaban, this is unlikely but not impossible). Or, it could be a case wherein Sirius's aunt married Molly's uncle and so they are cousins by marriage.
But what confuses me is Arthur's relation to Sirius.
Sirius says Arthur is 'something like his second cousin, once removed'. So let's call him that for argument's sake. A person from the HP4GU list tried valiantly to explain this to me using this chart and explanation and made up names, but that just confused me further.
She says Edward and Arthur are second cousins by the reasoning that William is Andrew and Margaret's first cousin, but wouldn't Edward and Arthur be third cousins? Arthur, being the son of Andrew who is Elizabeth's first cousin, would be Elizabeth's second cousin and Edwards third cousin, wouldn't he? :\ ???
Somebody help me, please!
Sirius says Molly is a cousin by marriage which seems to me would either mean that she is a sibling of someone who married one of his cousins, a cousin of his spouse or a cousin of his brother's spouse. Since Sirius never mentions being married and there is no spouse noted for Regelus when Harry is looking at the family tree (and since Regelus was younger than Sirius and Sirius was in his lower twenties if not barely twenty when he was sent to Azkaban, this is unlikely but not impossible). Or, it could be a case wherein Sirius's aunt married Molly's uncle and so they are cousins by marriage.
But what confuses me is Arthur's relation to Sirius.
Sirius says Arthur is 'something like his second cousin, once removed'. So let's call him that for argument's sake. A person from the HP4GU list tried valiantly to explain this to me using this chart and explanation and made up names, but that just confused me further.
She says Edward and Arthur are second cousins by the reasoning that William is Andrew and Margaret's first cousin, but wouldn't Edward and Arthur be third cousins? Arthur, being the son of Andrew who is Elizabeth's first cousin, would be Elizabeth's second cousin and Edwards third cousin, wouldn't he? :\ ???
Somebody help me, please!
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O_O
You know. By reading this I'm even more confused. :blinks:
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I was under the impression Arthur and Siruis were just second cousins.
I think I'm going to remain under that imperssion. These pureblood people should really stop marring inside thier family...
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*also completely lost*
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http://wymple.gs.net/~longstrt/consangu.html
The number of "G"s you share is the number of cousins you are. The difference in "G"s is the number "Removed". Example: Two people who have the same great-grand-parents (2G) are second cousins (2C). If the great-grand-parents (2G) of one person are the great-great-grand-parents (3G) of the other person, then those two people are second cousins, once removed (2C1R). They share 2G with a difference of 1G (3-2=1). Compare the chart.
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I think that one makes the most sense, to me anyway.
As for the cousins deal ... First of all, the term "cousin" means two they have an ancestor in common. With me so far? Okay.
Now, the nth cousin nth removed thing depends on how many generations they're removed from said common ancestor, and how many generational "steps" they're removed from each other.
For the nth cousin, n = number of generations between one's own generation and the common ancestor's, minus one. (If both cousins are not from the same generation, use the smallest value of "n", ie the one who is closest to the comon ancestor.)
For the n times removed, n = number of generations between the two cousins.
For example, the children of my dad's siblings are my first cousins (zero times removed), because we are two generational "steps" removed from our grandparents (us => our parents; our parents => our grandparents, so n = 2-1 = 1), but we're from the same generation (so n = 0).
My cousins's children and I are first cousins (I'm still the same generation, so n = still 1) once removed (because they're a generation younger than I am, so n = 1).
My hypothetical children will be these kids's second cousins (them => me and my cousins; me and my cousins => my dad and his siblings; my dad and his siblings => my grandparents; 3 steps, so n = 3-1 = 2) (zero times removed, because they're the same generation again.)
So, "second cousin once removed" means that they're one generation apart (we'll assume Sirius is one generation younger than Arthur, as this makes the most sense), and their common ancestor is Arthur's great-grandfather (Sirius's great-great-grandfather).
Does that make more sense?
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But, yes, I think I understand it now. Thanks. :)
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Umm...maybe Arthur and Molly are brother and sister? *bitten by a very nasty plot bunny*
Argh! They should all stop marrying each other!